Author Topic: SG style guitars  (Read 308 times)

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Offline Kossoff

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SG style guitars
« on: April 07, 2021, 10:57:11 am »
Any members playing these type of guitars (an Epiphone in my case) and willing to advise on set up specs. It doesnt matter how straight I get the truss rod, there is just too much 'boing' in the 5th to 12th fret area. Have never encountered this situation with any other of my guitars......electric or accoustic.

Offline tobyjenner

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Re: SG style guitars
« Reply #1 on: April 07, 2021, 11:53:59 am »
Kossoff

Welcome to the forum. Can offer any advice on how to fix the problem, if the rods been adjusted correctly and the saddle height but have no issues with my Gibson SG and not had to touch it bar changing strings, after it arrived from Thomann over a year ago (or there abouts).

When you so "boing" do you mean "bowing" ie the neck is bowed and lower in the middle then bridge and neck ? Or is that the sound its making. Just checking as it may make analysis easier for the more technical folk, who no doubt will be along at some stage.

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Offline LievenDV

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Re: SG style guitars
« Reply #2 on: April 07, 2021, 01:19:33 pm »
can you measure the distance between the string and the fretboard around the 12th fret,

is it somewhere 1.4 and 1.8 mm?
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Offline Jamolay

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Re: SG style guitars
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2021, 01:28:04 pm »
I am no expert either, but I have been studying and working on guitar setups.
Trying my first fret replacement now.

I don’t know what a “boing”means, but I still think it is too much relief or up-now in your truss. Assuming “boing” means too high action in that region of the fretboard.

If it is “buzz” and too low action, it could be too much backbow.

Other things would be poorly set frets, a warped neck or a badly set nut.

I would start by measuring the action up and down the fretboard. Write it all down. Are all the stings “boinging”? Or just some? You may need to measure action on each string and each fret.

Check your frets for level. Measure string height at the nut, too.

Google truss rods, action and read all you can, if you haven’t.

Offline Kossoff

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Re: SG style guitars
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2021, 01:34:55 pm »
Hello and thank you for the welcome Toby. Boing is the way I refer to the string action being too high in the 5 to 12 fret area of my guitar. Ive got the string action at my preferred height at the 12th fret but the guitar seems rather mushy and too high for me. Ive checked the straightness of the neck (capo first fret low E string.....hold same string down at last fret/fret that joins body...measure gap at mid point fret) and its nearly straight....maybe .005 mm.

 Any more tension on truss rod and Ill be heading for backbow country!  I love the guitar but it just exasperates me.


Offline Kossoff

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Re: SG style guitars
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2021, 01:52:10 pm »
can you measure the distance between the string and the fretboard around the 12th fret,

is it somewhere 1.4 and 1.8 mm?

Hello there. Bottom E is 1.5 mm at 12th fret and top e is 1.25mm at 12th fret. Thats as low as I go on electric guitars.

Offline Jamolay

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Re: SG style guitars
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2021, 01:58:27 pm »
Have you tried going somewhere that sell this guitar and just trying several to see if they have the same issue?

Offline Kossoff

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Re: SG style guitars
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2021, 05:39:26 pm »
Have you tried going somewhere that sell this guitar and just trying several to see if they have the same issue?

Not during the Covid restrictions. I haven't been in the local guitar shops for over a year.

Offline close2u

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Re: SG style guitars
« Reply #8 on: April 08, 2021, 08:11:26 am »
I honestly don't think your problem is guitar specific.
It's not that all SGs made by Epiphone will have this same problem.
If adjusting the various adjustable parts does not provide a fix then it may be something more substantial like poorly manufactured / fitted body / neck. But that conclusion is way off being a place to settle yet.

Offline close2u

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Re: SG style guitars
« Reply #9 on: April 08, 2021, 08:15:33 am »
For string height adjustments your entry points are:
truss rod and neck straightness / amount of bow ...
bridge adjustment and saddle height ...
nut slots ...

You say you have checked the neck and it is just bowed a little - not quite straight. THat sounds about optimal.
You mention the heights at fret 12 ... what about at other frets?
What is the action like nearer the nut? When pressing open chords is the intonation on them good or do notes sound a little sharp (suggesting the slots need filing down)?

Offline Kevin_NC

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Re: SG style guitars
« Reply #10 on: April 08, 2021, 01:32:35 pm »
g.....hold same string down at last fret/fret that joins body...measure gap at mid point fret) and its nearly straight....maybe .005 mm.



i am not an expert but this seems very low to me.  The only guitar manual I have is for an Ibanez Prestige RG but it has a spec for the neck bow.  Holding the 1st fret and the highest fret (24th in this case), the gap in the middle should be 0.3 to 0.5mm.  This spec will certianly be different on each guitar but 0.005mm is effectively 0 and the fretted notes don't have room to vibrate.  With a neck that straight, I suspect  you'd need a really high bridge to remove the buzz.



Offline Jamolay

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Re: SG style guitars
« Reply #11 on: April 08, 2021, 02:06:35 pm »
i am not an expert but this seems very low to me.  The only guitar manual I have is for an Ibanez Prestige RG but it has a spec for the neck bow.  Holding the 1st fret and the highest fret (24th in this case), the gap in the middle should be 0.3 to 0.5mm.  This spec will certianly be different on each guitar but 0.005mm is effectively 0 and the fretted notes don't have room to vibrate.  With a neck that straight, I suspect  you'd need a really high bridge to remove the buzz.
That does sound right. My acoustic had some difficult and I had to adjust the truss rod to increase the relief, giving a little higher action. Made it much easier to play and better sounding with only a tiny adjustment.

You might need to try small adjustments and see what you like. There are recommendations, but guitar setup is also kind of personal.

Offline Kossoff

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Re: SG style guitars
« Reply #12 on: April 08, 2021, 06:10:56 pm »
Apologies folks. My previous post stating that the relief is .005mm should have read .005 inches. The guitar is playable (albeit to my limited skill level). I might take it in to a local guitar fettler as and when the Covid situation allows.

Thanks to everyone who offered advice and suggestions.

Offline Kevin_NC

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Re: SG style guitars
« Reply #13 on: April 09, 2021, 03:28:23 am »
I kinda wondered how you were measure  in the thousandths of mm but .005 inch is still very tight,, ~0.13mm.  Nothing wrong with taking it to a pro but I prefer to do all my own adjustment until I need to do some non-reversible adjustments,  If it were mine, I'd put at least .3mm of curve in the neck then see if you can find a bridge height that gives you what you want.

 

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