Author Topic: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy  (Read 7600 times)

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #75 on: April 26, 2020, 12:16:19 pm »


G Major chord = G  -  B  -  D

B minor chord = B  -  D  -  F#

This 3rd could be seen / heard as either a G Major chord or as a B minor chord.

It is ambiguous.

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #76 on: April 26, 2020, 12:16:49 pm »


A Major chord = A  -  C#  -  E

C# diminished chord = C#  -  E  -  G

This 3rd could be seen / heard as either an A Major chord or as a C# diminished chord.

It is ambiguous.

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #77 on: April 26, 2020, 12:17:25 pm »


D Major chord = D  -  F#  -  A   

B minor chord = B  -  D  -  F#

This 3rd could be seen / heard as either a D Major chord or as a B minor chord.

It is ambiguous.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2020, 06:58:39 pm by close2u »

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #78 on: April 26, 2020, 12:17:56 pm »

E minor chord = E  -  G  -  B

C# diminished chord = C#  -  E  -  G

This 3rd could be seen / heard as either an E minor chord or as a C# diminished chord.

It is ambiguous.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2020, 07:43:51 pm by close2u »

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #79 on: April 26, 2020, 12:18:24 pm »

D Major chord = D  -  F#  -  A   

F# minor chord = F#  -  A  -  C#

This 3rd could be seen / heard as either a D Major chord or as an F# minor chord.

It is ambiguous.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2020, 07:44:19 pm by close2u »

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #80 on: April 26, 2020, 12:18:52 pm »


E minor chord = E  -  G  -  B

G Major chord = G  -  B  -  D

This 3rd could be seen / heard as either an E minor chord or as a G Major chord.

It is ambiguous.

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #81 on: April 26, 2020, 12:19:16 pm »

F# minor chord = F#  -  A  -  C#

A Major chord = A  -  C#  -  E

This 3rd could be seen / heard as either an F# minor chord or an A Major chord.

It is ambiguous.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2020, 07:47:35 pm by close2u »

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #82 on: April 26, 2020, 12:19:32 pm »
So the original TAB of 3rds could now be labelled with two chord names for each 3rd:


             G       A     Bm    C#dim     D      Em    F#m      G      A
            Em      F#m     G      A      Bm     C#dim   D      Em     F#m 
   




Where the chord names are really partial chords, either intervals between first and third or intervals between third and fifth.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2020, 02:24:00 pm by close2u »

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #83 on: April 26, 2020, 12:29:02 pm »
Maybe we can already anticipate what will follow ...

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #84 on: April 26, 2020, 01:23:36 pm »
The ambiguous character of 3rds continued further still

Let us now go through an entirely similar process for the 3rds on the D & G strings.
Here is each, this time labelled only with the note names and the character of the third they contain (Major or minor).




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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #85 on: April 26, 2020, 01:24:41 pm »

E minor chord = E  -  G  -  B

C# diminished chord = C#  -  E  -  G

This 3rd could be seen / heard as either an E minor chord or as a C# diminished chord.

It is ambiguous.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2020, 07:53:14 pm by close2u »

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #86 on: April 26, 2020, 01:25:13 pm »

D Major chord = D  -  F#  -  A   

F# minor chord = F#  -  A  -  C#

This 3rd could be seen / heard as either a D Major chord or as an F# minor chord.

It is ambiguous.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2020, 07:53:42 pm by close2u »

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #87 on: April 26, 2020, 01:25:22 pm »


E minor chord = E  -  G  -  B

G Major chord = G  -  B  -  D

This 3rd could be seen / heard as either an E minor chord or as a G Major chord.

It is ambiguous.

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #88 on: April 26, 2020, 01:25:30 pm »


F# minor chord = F#  -  A  -  C#

A Major chord = A  -  C#  -  E

This 3rd could be seen / heard as either an F# minor chord or an A Major chord.

It is ambiguous.

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #89 on: April 26, 2020, 01:25:38 pm »


G Major chord = G  -  B  -  D

B minor chord = B  -  D  -  F#

This 3rd could be seen / heard as either a G Major chord or as a B minor chord.

It is ambiguous.

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #90 on: April 26, 2020, 01:25:46 pm »


A Major chord = A  -  C#  -  E

C# diminished chord = C#  -  E  -  G

This 3rd could be seen / heard as either an A Major chord or as a C# diminished chord.

It is ambiguous.

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #91 on: April 26, 2020, 01:25:54 pm »


D Major chord = D  -  F#  -  A   

B minor chord = B  -  D  -  F#

This 3rd could be seen / heard as either a D Major chord or as a B minor chord.

It is ambiguous.
« Last Edit: April 26, 2020, 06:59:36 pm by close2u »

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #92 on: April 26, 2020, 01:26:02 pm »


E minor chord = E  -  G  -  B

C# diminished chord = C#  -  E  -  G

This 3rd could be seen / heard as either an E minor chord or as a C# diminished chord.

It is ambiguous.

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #93 on: April 26, 2020, 01:26:11 pm »
So the original TAB of 3rds could be labelled:


            Em       F#m        G        A         Bm      C#dim      D

           C#dim      D        Em        F#m        G        A        Bm                 
 



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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #94 on: April 26, 2020, 01:26:19 pm »
Putting all three sets of TABs together, with each 3rd labelled as two partial chords, gives us:



         C#dim     D     Em      F#m      G      A      Bm     C#dim     D

           A      Bm    C#dim     A      Bm     C#dim    G      A       Bm






             G       A     Bm    C#dim     D      Em    F#m      G      A
            Em      F#m     G      A      Bm     C#dim   D      Em     F#m 
   






            Em       F#m        G        A         Bm      C#dim      D

           C#dim      D        Em        F#m        G        A        Bm                 
 





« Last Edit: May 01, 2020, 01:22:26 pm by close2u »

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #95 on: April 30, 2020, 08:59:09 pm »
With this new found concept laid over the top of these 3rds, different approaches could follow in practice.

Played as a stand alone, playing the 3rds and moving between them in various musical, rhythmic ways, could lead your ear to hear some as natural stopping places of happy resolution and stability, whilst others could sound a teeny bit off-colour if you land and stay on them within your own context, so are best used as passing 3rds, stepping stones between 3rds that suit that role better. But the fluidity and restriction will be very loose and elastic. You will probably find that you can pretty much play what you want, as you want, when you want and it will all sound pretty darn good.


Played over a backing track of a defined chord progression, you may find that there are definitely some 'good' 3rds and some 'not-so-good' 3rds over certain chords. Those that sound right and those you need to pass by fairly quickly. This ties in with the tabbed notation above where each 3rd is named as a suggestion of a chord. Take, for example a simple I, vi, IV, V chord progression in D:

D, Bm, G, A.

Over the D chord any of the 3rds named D will sound perfectly at home.
Can you find others that sit beautifully on top of that D chord also?
Can you find any that sound wrong over it?

Try the other chords with the same critical ear and questioning approach in your play.
What works and where?
What doesn't?


For those 3rds that do work can you begin a little analysis yourself?
Why do they sound good?
What notes are in the 3rds that sound good?
What connection do they have to the chord in the progression?
« Last Edit: May 01, 2020, 08:41:57 am by close2u »

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #96 on: May 01, 2020, 08:44:38 am »
Chords extended beyond the triads

So far all that we have focussed on in terms of chords are triads. Chords that are obtained by stacking three thirds in the process of harmonising the Major scale. That process can continue beyond just the first, third and fifth. If another step along the notes of the Major scale is taken, if the next interval of a third beyond the fifth is included, we start to create chords with a seventh in them. These seventh chords can be Major 7, minor 7 or dominant 7.

I do not intend going through the formulation of each and every chord in painstaking detail, so shall cut right to the chase here.

The D Major scale …


D  -  E  -  F#  -  G  -  A  -  B  -  C#  -  D  -  E  -  F#  -  G  -  A  -  B  -  C#  -  D


The chords resulting from stacking four lots of thirds together:

1] D Major 7 = D  -  F#  -  A – C#

2] Em7 = E  -  G  -  B  -  D

3] F#m7 = F#  -  A  -  C#  -  E

4] G Major 7 = G  -  B  -  D  –  F#

5] A7 = A  -  C#  -  E  -  G

6] Bm7 = B  -  D  -  F#  -  A

7] C# m7b5 = C#  -  E  -  G  -  B

Now each harmonised chord comprises a new third pairing at the end of their respective formulae. But, importantly, none of these pairs are new, they have all appeared previously in different chords and different guises. Some as a pair of first to third intervals. Some as a pair of third to fifth intervals. It was these two types that allowed us to reach the point above where we could say that each 3rd can be suggestive of two chords, not just one.

The extension of that very same idea will allow us to see that each 3rd can also be seen / heard as suggestive of a type of seventh chord - if it is being played over that chord in the backing.

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #97 on: May 01, 2020, 08:47:20 am »
 
 


Previously this was suggestive of either a D Major or a B minor chord.

We can now add to that. When played over a G Major chord, this 3rd will add the quality of G Major 7 to the sound.

G Major 7 = G  -  B  -  D – F#

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #98 on: May 01, 2020, 08:50:39 am »
 
 

Previously this was suggestive of either an E minor or a C# diminished chord.

We can now add to that. When played over an A Major chord, this 3rd will add the quality of A7 to the sound.

A7 chord = A  -  C#  -  E  -  G
« Last Edit: May 01, 2020, 07:55:09 pm by close2u »

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Re: 3rds & Thirds ... an exploration to enjoy
« Reply #99 on: May 01, 2020, 08:52:41 am »
 


Previously this was suggestive of either an F# minor or a D Major chord.

We can now add to that. When played over a B minor chord, this 3rd will add the quality of B minor 7 to the sound.

B minor 7 chord = B  -  D  -  F# - A
« Last Edit: May 01, 2020, 07:56:04 pm by close2u »

 

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