Author Topic: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.  (Read 15074 times)

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Offline sairfingers

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Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« on: June 13, 2019, 12:40:32 pm »
Those of you who’ve read my ‘looper pedal for boss katana 50’ posts know I’ve bought a Trio+, so I thought I should start a new topic for my question. 

When creating ‘band’ backings if a song verse or chorus has a chord progression that repeats twice (or more), is it best to play the verse/chorus all the way through or only play one progression and then use the sequence button to repeat the progression?
I’ve tried both ways but am getting into a terrible muddle. I’m trying to do ‘Lay lady lady’ but some of the choruses have 2 progressions, others have 3.
The sequence facility has 5 spaces but when verses and or choruses vary in length 5 variations is not enough. I’m maybe answering my own question here as in this case you would record one progression.

Advice please guys!
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Offline close2u

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #1 on: June 13, 2019, 01:11:31 pm »
Think of a song in repeating sections, some of which are identical, some of which may vary.

Examples.

Section A (verse) - 8 bars, 4 chords x2 each
Section B (chorus) - 12 bars, 3 chords x4 each
Section C (bridge) - 8 bars, 2 chords x4 each

Record each section separately and assign to a different button on the Trio+.

Song structure:
A, A, B, A, B, C, B, B
Press buttons
1, 1, 2, 1, 2, 3, 2, 2

Suppose that there is a variation on section A making it not 8 but 10 bars long for instance, you would need to record a separate section D and assign it accordingly to a button on the Trio+.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2019, 03:45:06 pm by close2u »

Offline sairfingers

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #2 on: June 13, 2019, 01:51:22 pm »
Thanks close. But if you add an intro and outro to your example and the verses are different? Not enough spaces in the sequence.
Working hard at this, it’s great fun but a bit frustrating when it gets messed up and you have start all over again!
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Offline Rossco01

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #3 on: June 13, 2019, 03:16:20 pm »
In your example in the first post. I would record your chord progression once (not the full Chorus). Then when you programme the song for those choruses where it repeats twice you press the button associated with that chord progression twice and then for those choruses where the the chord progression is three time your press the button associated with that progression three times.

You might only have 5 parts you can record BUT when programming the song you can programme those parts in any order and as many times as you like, just by pressing the button again. I've only had odd times where a Chorus or Verse varies slightly through the song that I've almost run out of parts BUT it's pretty rare.

Look at Close's post again. What he describes as a Section is one of your five parts you can record. The button presses are for when you are programming the song.
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Offline sairfingers

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #4 on: June 13, 2019, 04:31:34 pm »
Thanks Rossco
I’m getting there with this but I’ve recorded and re-recorded the parts and re-sequenced them so many times today that what used to be one of my favourite Dylan songs is in danger of becoming one I never want to hear again!

I’ve also realised you have to write down exactly what you’ve done, otherwise you get in a total mess forgetting which part is which and what each part contains.

As I said before, it’s great fun but where has the day gone?
Studying Intermediate Course, Folk Fingerstyle and Blues modules.
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Offline Rossco01

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #5 on: June 13, 2019, 07:53:10 pm »
Its a bit of a learning curve but once you are there it gets a lot easier. In terms of remembering then that should be easy the backing track will follow the chords so you just need to make sure that you start (I find the count in useful) when the backing track starts....as long as you follow the chord progression you'll be in time. This is a skill you need whether you use the Trio or a normal backing track.

Another tip is not to assume that the right drum track is on the appropriate style...for instance sometimes you'll find a country style strum track works better against a rock or pop track than a one of that style.
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Offline sairfingers

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #6 on: June 13, 2019, 09:20:37 pm »
Another tip is not to assume that the right drum track is on the appropriate style...for instance sometimes you'll find a country style strum track works better against a rock or pop track than a one of that style.
Yes, I agree, you really have to experiment here. I suppose they had to give the genres a name as a reference point but the names are pretty meaningless.
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Offline CT

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #7 on: June 15, 2019, 01:45:03 am »
I have the Trio Band Creator, which I guess is being discontinued now, and I mostly keep  things simple. I wouldn't want anything that is more complex. Try getting your legs under you first by working with progressions or songs with one or two parts. Get good at some of those and then branch out. When the songs get complex, the fun and spontaneity go out the window for me. YMMV.   

Offline sairfingers

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #8 on: June 15, 2019, 08:38:14 am »
When the songs get complex, the fun and spontaneity go out the window for me.
A very good point CT. I’m getting a bit ahead of myself trying to explore the possibilities of the Trio+. I’ve already gone back to simpler progressions with fewer parts.

Also. A 63 page instruction manual is available online. Only use it when you are stuck. If you read through it all at once, it’s a bit daunting!
« Last Edit: June 15, 2019, 11:50:48 am by sairfingers »
Studying Intermediate Course, Folk Fingerstyle and Blues modules.
Pickin’ an’ lickin’.....😎. Martin D28 : Gibson SG : Boss Katana 50.
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Offline CT

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #9 on: June 15, 2019, 05:29:47 pm »
@sairfingers, looking forward to hearing some tracks with your new rig. Here's an acoustic A Minor Thing that I recorded a while back using the Trio.


Offline sairfingers

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #10 on: June 15, 2019, 10:52:02 pm »
Here's an acoustic A Minor Thing
Very good CT. Gives me something to aim for! Unfortunately my computer skills and equipment are not sufficient to record and upload stuff, so you will be spared my playing. Lol 😃
Studying Intermediate Course, Folk Fingerstyle and Blues modules.
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Offline Matt125

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #11 on: June 30, 2019, 09:47:39 am »
Here's how I would do it.

Figure the song out first!

Lay Lady Lay

Intro        | A / C#m / |G# / Bm / |  x 2

Verse 1     | A / C#m / |G# / Bm / |  x 4       it's the same as the verse

Chorus      | E / F#m / | A /  /  /  |    x 2

Verse 2     | as above |   x 6

Chorus      | as above |   x 2

Verse ?      | as above |  x 2

Bridge        | C#m / / / | E / A / | C#m / / /  | A / / / | C#m / / / | A / / / | C#m / / / | Bm / / / | x 1

Verse   ?    | as above | x 4

Chorus      | as above | x 2

Verse        | as above |  x 4

Outro        | A / Bm / |  C#m / E A |


So you can break it up into 4 parts

Record the Intro (just the two bars) into slot 1 (this will also be used for the verse)
Record the Chorus ( the two bars) into slot 2
Record the Bridge (the full bridge)  in slot 3
Record the outro (the full outro)  in slot 4

Now hit the sequencer   1 1  1 1 1 1  2 2  1 1 1 1 1 1  2 2  1 1  3  1 1 1 1  2 2  1 1 1 1  4

And you should be able to play along.






Offline sairfingers

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #12 on: June 30, 2019, 02:50:49 pm »
Here's how I would do it. Figure the song out first! Lay Lady Lay.
Wow thanks Matt you’ve put a lot of time into this! I’ve been using simpler sequences and getting to know my Trio+ but you’ve encouraged me to try Lay Lady Lay again. I’ll let you know how I get on.
Studying Intermediate Course, Folk Fingerstyle and Blues modules.
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Offline sairfingers

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #13 on: June 30, 2019, 05:37:57 pm »
The most annoying and frustrating thing about the Trio+ is the ease with which you can spend several hours perfecting something only to then realise you have overwritten a previous thing you spent hours perfecting. Aarrrggghhh!! Don’t let me near the kitchen knives! 🤬🤬

Update. Don’t worry, I’m now in the garden chilling with a beer!
« Last Edit: June 30, 2019, 06:01:35 pm by sairfingers »
Studying Intermediate Course, Folk Fingerstyle and Blues modules.
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Offline Rossco01

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #14 on: June 30, 2019, 08:20:21 pm »
Siarfingers I'm sure you already know but there is a windows app that allows you to save off the songs you've created. I know it doesn't stop you over writing but if you've absolutely got something as you want it then id save it that way
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Offline Matt125

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #15 on: July 01, 2019, 12:25:31 am »
The most annoying and frustrating thing about the Trio+ is the ease with which you can spend several hours perfecting something only to then realise you have overwritten a previous thing you spent hours perfecting.

Another one is constructing a song track in a slot and then forgetting what it was because you haven't used the Trio+ for a while!

So take Rossco01's advice and download the Trio Manager software.  It allows you to name the track to something useful. You can then save it off the card and move it back when you need it.  I only just discovered it myself.

Windows : https://digitech.com/en/softwares/trio-manager-v1-1-0-windows-7-and-later
Mac: https://digitech.com/en/softwares/trio-manager-v1-1-0-mac-os-x-10-8-5-or-later


You'll also need a microsd card reader e.g.



Offline sairfingers

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #16 on: July 01, 2019, 09:27:15 am »
Thanks for the advice Rossco/Matt. Part of the learning curve is screwing things up! I’ll give the Manager software a go but will also ensure I keep a note of what’s where and not rely on memory. Maybe use song slots 1-6 for things I’m working on and keeping and the others for ‘messing around’ and practising scales etc. I doubt I’ll ever have 12 perfect song backing tracks but who knows.

It really is a great bit of kit. At the moment I’m using my electric to create the backing then using my accoustic to play along. Great fun!
Studying Intermediate Course, Folk Fingerstyle and Blues modules.
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Offline Rossco01

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #17 on: July 02, 2019, 08:20:59 pm »
I was doing a little noodling tonight so thought I'd record it. Sound quality isn't the best (I could have done with turning up Trio a bit) but you get the gist. It shows me building a basic drum/bass track from 12 bar blues in B, then overlaying the 12 bar blues itself (almost forgetting the turnaround!) and then finally a little solo noodling over the top.



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Offline sairfingers

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #18 on: July 03, 2019, 09:37:33 am »
Great stuff Rossco. I see you have the extra foot switch (FS3X) for your Trio+. I think I need one as when it’s on the floor it’s not easy to change settings (old eyes!) and if it’s beside you on the seat you need a third hand to operate it!
What extra cables are needed for the foot switch? The diagram on the instructions calls it a TRS cable, is that different from a normal guitar to amp cable? Also the diagram doesn’t show a power supply to the switch, does it take its power from the Trio?

Update - I’ve just looked up TS and TRS cables on Google. Yes, they are different but the explanation as to the difference sent me to sleep! I just like things to work I don’t need to know why. Lol.
Studying Intermediate Course, Folk Fingerstyle and Blues modules.
Pickin’ an’ lickin’.....😎. Martin D28 : Gibson SG : Boss Katana 50.
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Offline Rossco01

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #19 on: July 03, 2019, 09:46:28 am »
Glad you liked it. I have to admit I'm not sure on the extra cable as I bought the Trio Plus, FS and cable all together second hand. It looks just like a normal 1/4" guitar cable, certainly the connectors are.
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Offline sairfingers

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #20 on: July 03, 2019, 02:06:02 pm »
Update - I’ve just looked up TS and TRS cables on Google. Yes, they are different but the explanation as to the difference sent me to sleep! I just like things to work I don’t need to know why. Lol.
Further update - A TRS cable is included with the foot switch! Problem solved.
Studying Intermediate Course, Folk Fingerstyle and Blues modules.
Pickin’ an’ lickin’.....😎. Martin D28 : Gibson SG : Boss Katana 50.
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Offline Matt125

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #21 on: July 04, 2019, 01:06:05 pm »
A friend recently wanted  me to learn Day Tripper.  It’s not too difficult, so wrote up a chord chart and built the song on the Trio+.
The chord chart and tlsd file are posted at the end.

Tips for tweaking:

1. Genre/Style Knob
Teach the Trio+  part 1 of the song. It will choose  the genre/style what it thinks is appropriate.
Play around with genre options until you find something that seems reasonable.
Play with the style option to find the best option in that genre.

2. Simple Bass button
You have three options for Bass
Off  =  Active.  This means that the bass line will be more complex and more improvisational.
Green = Root Riff.  It will only play the roots of each chord.
Red = Simple Root.  Only plays the first root note of each bar.


3.Part Button option.
You can tap this and change it to red to add some intensity to the part.

4. Alt/time button.  Sometimes the Trio misunderstands the tempo. You might be aiming for 70 and it picks it up as 140. If the tempo seems to fast or slow this can be used to halve it. I’m not yet sure if it doubles it   You can  force it to select the fastest or slowest tempo when you teach it. (see page 30).

5. Tempo
Teach the Trio part 1. Then select part 2 and arm the trio (the red light will flash) Now press and hold the part 2 button for 2 seconds. It will then flash and the Trio will match the tempo of the previous. If you look at the file in the Trio manager it will show the tempo it has selected.  Notice in the Trio manager that the tempos dont match. That is because I redid part one using a metronome. If part one is redone it has nothing previous to match. I matched part 2 to part 1.

I have also added the tlsd file.  You can drag this into the folder "Trio+ Song Library" which is created when you install the Trio Manager. Now when you startup Trio Manager you should see the file and you can drag it onto the SD Card in one of the 12 slots.

I built it in 4 parts
Part1 - The intro
Part2 - The verse
Part3 - The chorus
Part4 - The interlude and solo

I sequenced as 1 2 3 2 3 4 2 3 1 1








Day Tripper tlsd file
« Last Edit: July 04, 2019, 01:44:34 pm by Matt125 »

Offline Matt125

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #22 on: July 04, 2019, 01:21:01 pm »
Here is my attempt at Lay Lady Lay.  I constructed it as outlined in a previous post.  Note that the tempos match. I achieved this by holding down the part button for 2 seconds prior to teaching the Trio parts subsequent to part 1.  I chose Genre/style = Folk/2 as I felt this was closest.



Lay Lady Lay tlsd file


Offline sairfingers

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #23 on: July 04, 2019, 03:20:54 pm »
Guys, my FS3X footswitch has just arrived from Amazon. I can already tell this is a must have addition to the Trio+.
Studying Intermediate Course, Folk Fingerstyle and Blues modules.
Pickin’ an’ lickin’.....😎. Martin D28 : Gibson SG : Boss Katana 50.
Road case : https://justinguitarcommunity.com/index.php?topic=48801.0

Offline sairfingers

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Re: Digitech Trio+ Some advice please.
« Reply #24 on: July 04, 2019, 08:47:41 pm »
This is great stuff Matt. Thanks very much for sharing your hard work and thanks too for the tweaking tips. Even with the 2 second push on the part button, I find it hard to get the tempo the same across all the parts. The Trio seems to want to do its own thing!
Studying Intermediate Course, Folk Fingerstyle and Blues modules.
Pickin’ an’ lickin’.....😎. Martin D28 : Gibson SG : Boss Katana 50.
Road case : https://justinguitarcommunity.com/index.php?topic=48801.0

 

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