Author Topic: Help required..(melody & chords)  (Read 12347 times)

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Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #25 on: July 08, 2013, 10:06:59 am »
Hi Francis,

em7b5 is a bit of a stretch in first position. I'll think about it and have a practice.

This altered tuning would put all the notes as open strings or within reach of four fingers. Starting on the thickest E string, E A D A C# F. If you wanted to put D as the lowest root note, you could either change the thick E to D or put a capo on the 5th fret and use the 5th and 4th strings to play the roots.

Not sure what it would sound like over the whole progression as the 3rds, 5ths, etc will be in a different order for each chord. You could put them in the same order, but that would involve a lot of string skipping and some notes would go up and others go down. Either way, it may sound horrid or it may sound funky.

If we sort out the E major chord, is the A/Am that much of a problem? The arpeggio you put up first sounded good against the acoustic rhythm, including the A major chord.

Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #26 on: July 08, 2013, 11:14:11 am »
Hi Frances,

shall we start a thread with the heading Cynestasia as the track starts to come together. That way people can follow, if they want, how we get to the final track. It may be helpful for people considering doing the same thing.

diadem

Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #27 on: July 08, 2013, 08:43:21 pm »
I've added a bass (kick) drum to the song to link the first two verses to the instrumental. I've also put the drum on the bridge and the outro. The hot weather was getting to me and I wilted, so they may not be on the beat, but as a guide they are fine.

I tried to put a drum beat all though the instrumental but the increase in speed made it difficult and I gave up. The drum at 80bpm could go on a little longer, seemed a bit abrupt for me listening back.

Alternatively we could forget about the drums in the first part and use the guitar as a link to the wild violin. Have a listen and let me know what you think.

I'm back at work tomorrow (booooo), so my time will be limited until Saturday.

diadem

https://soundcloud.com/diademgrove/cynestasia-rough-drum-mix/s-Wx1Tk

Offline frances

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #28 on: July 09, 2013, 06:34:42 am »
i definitely don't want to keep the clapping part in the beginning, i thought they were there as a rhythm guide.

 i wandered off in a direction today because i wanted to see if that em7b5 would work in any way, tired of playing it so played faster and ended up with this:
 https://soundcloud.com/user4528050/faster-with-electric

  so thats a possible thing to do, but now i've heard the chord i was trying out too many times and can't tell if it sounds weird. the electric is more an example of a sound to have than what notes to have. i was unaware of how different it got until i listened to the original.

.....Hey! drums aren't confined to what's physically possible, cut and paste, man! cut and paste!

 if we somehow got the end of the guitar part like the last note and kind of warped somehow to pull it into the instrumental that would be cool.



 













 
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Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #29 on: July 09, 2013, 07:26:31 am »
off to work, I'll have a re-listen when I get home.

The clapping is a guide, its awful and won't be staying.

When I played em7b5 it sounded too close to Gm7 for me.

I never cut and paste or use quantise, I prefer human error. Although I do admit to slightly moving some drum beats.

Offline frances

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #30 on: July 09, 2013, 05:15:04 pm »
  yup, that e does sound weird, sry about that.

 yes, i do have a keyboard, two in fact,what do you want with it?

I was totally having a rave party with the looper the other day, it was fun. i figure that i set out to learn guitar, not how to tap out a drum beat on a keyboard, i don't like premade loops though.

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Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #31 on: July 09, 2013, 05:42:07 pm »
Hi Frances,

time to take stock I think (reply to your last post is at the bottom).

Your arpeggio made me want to do the song, I'd like to keep it. We have a problem with my chord progression. We can dump it or think of something different to do over it. This isn't as stupid as it sounds as the refrain will be sang over it.

I like the idea of the song have two tempos, but could be persuaded to increase the speed. It may make singing over it easier.

I don't like the drums going into the instrumental. They will be coming out. A continuation of the arpeggio for a bar would be interesting, especially if we do something weird with the last note as you suggested.

Liked the electric rhythm guitar. Do you fancy doing 4 recordings of the rhythm for the bridge and the last verse, the chords are on one of the demos I posted. If you can't find them I'll repost them. No lead work just yet. If you do, try different pickup selections and if you have access to amp modelling, use different amp models. You could them all on one downloadable track and I'll cut and paste, just leave enough silence between each take. The tempo is 109bpm, I don't think we need to play over the rough demos.

As I said we have a democratic band room, if you disagree just say so.

The weather's taking most of my energy, so its time for a cup of tea, methinks.

Its coming together nicely I think.

diadem

ps  just seen your last post. It may be easier to play the arpeggio on keyboard, not so many weird hand shapes. The only problem would be the sustain on the last note of the introduction, but a nice grand piano would sound good.

I don't know how to do loops, so its just tapping on the keyboard for me.

No need to apologise, weird can be fun.

Offline frances

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #32 on: July 10, 2013, 06:35:38 am »
 weird isn't good in this instance. i like the way the electric sounds underneath the acoustic. 
...yeah that's part of the problem with the arpeggio, trying to keep it sounding ok without it being fidgety with the vocals.
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Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #33 on: July 10, 2013, 07:22:28 am »
Hi Frances,

I'm going to Leeds today for work, not fun, but better than going to London. I'll sort out the acoustic guitar for the first two verses and hopefully by the weekend I'll be ready to do a guide vocal. We should have enough then to see whether the arpeggio works or not. When I put up the demo of the vocal I may cut and paste your original arpeggio to see how it fits.

If you can record the electric rhythm guitars we will be on the way to completing the basic rhythm track.

I agree I'd prefer the electric guitar over the acoustic.

Well off to work.

diadem

Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #34 on: July 11, 2013, 05:11:51 pm »
Thanks Frances, sounds good. I'll download them  later and start work on them tomorrow and Saturday.

I'll have to get my bits done soon,

diadem

Offline frances

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #35 on: July 11, 2013, 06:45:41 pm »
Arg! crud! i'm not very happy with them, trying get better takes.........didn't want to be doing "just one more" for the next three weeks.
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Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #36 on: July 11, 2013, 07:18:15 pm »
If you keep posting them I'll keep downloading them. The more the merrier. I intend to have completed the first two verses with guide vocal together with the bridge and final verse by the end of the weekend. If you're still not happy we'll re-do the last bit. We should have a clearer idea of where we are going. I think we'll be ok.

Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #37 on: July 11, 2013, 09:03:39 pm »
Dear all,

On Saturday, 12 noon UK time I will delete a number of the rough drafts of Cynestasia. I will keep up the Dm to D demo and the one with the drums on. All the others will go. If you want to download them (I can't understand why) you have a couple of days to do so.

Over the weekend I will post some more demos which may be quite close to the finished track and I don't want to clutter up more soundcard account with lots of rough sketches.

Frances I've downloaded everything I need up to Guitar 4 if you want to do something similar.

Thanks,

diadem

Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #38 on: July 11, 2013, 10:22:24 pm »
Hi Frances,

this is what I would like your electric rhythm guitar playing to rest on. If you could pick (or record) a nice clean track to go on top. I've recorded the acoustic guitars but need to get a good mix first. I may add the acoustic to the bridge and final verse, depends if it works.

I like the sound of the processed electric guitars but they need a clean dry sound on the top. Hope you like them too.

https://soundcloud.com/diademgrove/cynestasia-rough-electric/s-srbgS

diadem

Offline frances

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #39 on: July 12, 2013, 06:54:26 am »
 :D That's a cool trick, i'll remember that one. i think i've almost got this noise thing under control. i don't like the digital noise that noise removal leaves behind but at least it's not that godawful hiss.

https://soundcloud.com/user4528050/dry-rhythm

https://soundcloud.com/user4528050/electric-rythym-mix
« Last Edit: July 12, 2013, 07:18:15 am by frances »
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Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #40 on: July 12, 2013, 07:23:35 am »
:D That's a cool trick, i'll remember that one. i think i've almost got this noise thing under control. i don't like the digital noise but at least its not that godawful hiss.

https://soundcloud.com/user4528050/dry-rhythm

Downloaded. Shame about the hiss I liked it. I was going to leave it in at the end of the electric violin part to see if it sounded ok. Tonight I'll work on the acoustic guitar parts I recorded. It'll take some time because I recorded in stereo with two mics so I could split the results later. In an ideal world I'd have the facility to multi-track without all this messing about, but at least I'll have two slightly different sounds from the two mics.

I like the dry rhythm guitar.

Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #41 on: July 12, 2013, 10:44:20 pm »
Hi Frances,

I'm definitely wilting in this heat. But I have a few days off work. I've started the drums for the bridge and last verse. I'm all set for a go at the vocals tomorrow. I think its coming along nicely. Watch me spoil it with my singing.

diadem

Offline frances

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #42 on: July 13, 2013, 05:16:58 pm »
Don't do the drums over the electric track, it's way off and needs to be redone. recording over it will make the drums off too.
I spend a lot of time in bed eating crackers, this tells you much about both my character and learning ability.

Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #43 on: July 13, 2013, 05:25:36 pm »
Don't do the drums over the electric track, it's way off and needs to be redone. recording over it will make the drums off too.

Its already done, together with the vocals. I'll be having my tea (evening meal) shortly in case its not up. If you just wait a while you can hear the results. I don't think you were that far off.

Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #44 on: July 13, 2013, 05:55:23 pm »
Here it is, I quite like it.

Your electric part missed the first beat of the bar. Once I found that out your timing wasn't very far off my acoustic version. If you want to redo the parts we can start the last bit again.

Hope my singing doesn't put you off.

https://soundcloud.com/diademgrove/cynestasia-very-rough-mix-1/s-oyqIn

Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #45 on: July 13, 2013, 10:22:05 pm »
Hi Frances,

I've had another listen, or two. I may change some of the words, so that we have an aabb rhyme. I think the bridge could do with a few more words as well.

It would also help if I could sing properly, but Rome wasn't built in a day. Other than that I think it still hangs together nicely.

diadem

Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #46 on: July 14, 2013, 04:33:28 pm »
Hi Francis,

I like the arpeggio. Can please you put it up on its own so that I can mess about with the balance.

Have you redone the electric rhythm guitar? I see you put two track up yesterday but they sound the same as the old ones to me. My judgement has gone a bit funny after listening to my vocal. But your arpeggio playing has restored my spirits.

diadem

Offline frances

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #47 on: July 14, 2013, 04:44:17 pm »
hi,

 i find the 4 on the floor rhythm a bit martial, is there any way you could start on beat 2 and play with the beats a little?
here is what i've got for the first part. i think it may indeed be fidgety, but if we add one more layer of guitar it could work. could you add some some arpeggiated chords? i feel as though the acoustic needs to be settled within a space in some way  either with a keyboard or guitar surrounding.

https://soundcloud.com/user4528050/part-1-w-arpeggio

........sure, it's got mistakes and stuff, .............i didn't upload anything yesterday, it must be some sort of problem with the site. i will, i will, i will complete the electric track today, for real this time, really. i just needed to win at my little game of tetris i had going on.

I spend a lot of time in bed eating crackers, this tells you much about both my character and learning ability.

Offline diademgrove

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #48 on: July 14, 2013, 05:30:27 pm »
Hi Frances,

no need to hurry. I thought you'd heard my vocal and ran away.

I'll think about the drums. The problem is my limited ability. Once you have the electric rhythm done to your satisfaction I'll have a mess about with the drums. I quite like the 4 to the floor beat, but not enough to insist on it.

I'll put some guitar over verse 1 and 2 once I hear your stem with my vocal to see where everything sits.

I had to ask what tetris is and I'm still not sure.

diadem

ps I thought I'd heard the stem but it was the demo, I have now and changed this reply.

Offline frances

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Re: Help required.....
« Reply #49 on: July 14, 2013, 06:20:54 pm »
yeah, this time i uploaded the wrong file and had to change it. i meant with the vocal- i HEAR instead of EYYE HEAR.
I spend a lot of time in bed eating crackers, this tells you much about both my character and learning ability.

 

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