Author Topic: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome  (Read 39987 times)

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Offline justinguitar

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #25 on: February 15, 2012, 01:52:04 pm »
@twilkes

 your friend makes a really good point!!  playing scales too much will lead you to just playing scales when you try and solo.  but, to start off with you have to be able to play the scale up and down solidly. It'll help with the coordination of your left and right hands, and get the notes in the scale solidly under your fingers.

 Once you can play the scale up and down consistently evenly and coordination between your 2 hands is okay, you need to start breaking up the scale. There are a number of ways of doing this, pattern studies are probably the most obvious place to start (there are lessons on this on the site) and I go into a lot of detail on how to do this with all 5 positions in the DVD master the major scale, which you might like to check out when you finish the intermediate course.

"You can get help from teachers, but you are going to have to learn a lot by yourself, sitting alone in a room." Dr. Seuss

sanchezgtrs

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #26 on: February 16, 2012, 03:06:16 am »
Should I look away from the fretboard during this exercise?  I don't know if it's just psychological, but I think I actually make FEWER mistakes when I don't look at my fretting hand.  It makes me less nervous somehow.

The answer is you should be doing both.  Take it one-step at a time. Look at the fretboard in the first place to make sure you are actually playing the exercise correctly. After a few tries your fingers begin to automatically, place themselves in the correct position aided by your ears. Peek here and there until you create the correct hand-memory.  Finally, you are able to play the exercise completely without even looking at the fretboard because you are now playing it at a subconscious level.

SarangHae

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #27 on: August 15, 2012, 04:52:34 pm »
I just can't do this exercise. My timing never improves. I have always done this exercise at 60 bpm, one note per beat, for over A YEAR NOW, but I can never nail it perfectly; perfect, perfect, a little too fast, perfect, a  little too slow, too fast....
 To be honest, I can't even follow the metronome perfectly with clapping or tapping my foot. I have tried everything.

-Focus more
-Focus less
-Sway about while playing
-Closed eyes, eyes on fretboard, eyes on picking hand
-Using a metronome that visualise the rythm
-Using drum machines

Since timing is so fundemental to playing an instrument, I fear that I am not apt for music  and guitarplaying at all, and it is all terrifying.
What can I do about this? Or am I a lost cause ?

Offline stitch101

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #28 on: August 15, 2012, 07:13:47 pm »
Try playing it a little faster. 60bpm is pretty slow and gives you to much time to thing between beats.
Bump it up by 10bpm then 10 more until you find the speed your are comfortable with. Play that speed
until your can do it with no mistakes then start speeding up.

Offline Cue Zephyr

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #29 on: August 15, 2012, 07:45:40 pm »
Playing (really) slowly is an important skill too. ;)
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Offline stitch101

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #30 on: August 16, 2012, 04:59:37 pm »
Playing (really) slowly is an important skill too. ;)

Like you said  An Important Skill and until you develop you inner time clock it is a hard skill
to master. This is why new players want to shred and play fast solos it easier than playing slow.

That's why I suggested that SarangHae should speed up a little it find that inner clock. Once your
in sinc with your inner clock you will find keeping time easier. Then the skill is to change that clock
at will. Faster or slower

 

SarangHae

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #31 on: August 16, 2012, 05:50:22 pm »
The problem is that there is no comfortable speed. Faster speeds are not easier to follow, rather they make my inaccuracy less obvious,

Offline sophiehiker

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #32 on: August 16, 2012, 06:05:49 pm »
Let's try to "break it down".

1.) Can you tap your foot along with the metronome at 60 beats per minute?
2.) While tapping your foot can you pluck one string, one note along with the metronome?  All down picks?
3.) Same thing as above, but alternating up and down picks?
4.) Same thing, but picking two notes on the same string.  One note down pick, the second up pick.  Are you still tapping your foot?
...where the deer and the antelope play.  Well, they're not really playing.  They're fleeing in terror.

joshs

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #33 on: August 16, 2012, 06:07:39 pm »
Playing with a metronome is very unintuitive (but it's useful once you're ready for it). In the mean time, it sounds like you need to get in touch with basic rhythm. Ideas... every day, put on one of your favorite dance-able tracks and dance/clap along with it. Really loosen up and feel the rhythm. Go to a drum circle if you can find one. Take a dance class. If you got a lady/guy dance with them (even more fun ;-) ).

SarangHae

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #34 on: August 16, 2012, 06:53:08 pm »
Let's try to "break it down".

1.) Can you tap your foot along with the metronome at 60 beats per minute?
2.) While tapping your foot can you pluck one string, one note along with the metronome?  All down picks?
3.) Same thing as above, but alternating up and down picks?
4.) Same thing, but picking two notes on the same string.  One note down pick, the second up pick.  Are you still tapping your foot?

 Unfortunately, the answer is no, to every question:/

Playing with a metronome is very unintuitive (but it's useful once you're ready for it). In the mean time, it sounds like you need to get in touch with basic rhythm. Ideas... every day, put on one of your favorite dance-able tracks and dance/clap along with it. Really loosen up and feel the rhythm. Go to a drum circle if you can find one. Take a dance class. If you got a lady/guy dance with them (even more fun ;-) ).

I guess I could try dance classes. It sure sounds like fun. I still doubt the notion that the intuitive sense of timing  can be taught at all. Seems like one of those talents that you are either born with or without.  But I wouldn't know till I've tried.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2012, 07:42:03 am by close2u »

Offline jcb

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #35 on: August 30, 2012, 01:43:22 pm »
hi, i have a question re left palm / guitar neck position as you're working up the speed.
for background, i've done all my practice so far in the major scale of G, i.e. as per justin's lesson.
i'm now (after a few weeks) at about 130->140bpm, double picks per beat (i.e. 260 ->280 picks per minute).
i find that as i start the scale on the low g (6th string / 3rd fret), i'm playing with my left thumb on the back of the neck and the rest of my palm clear of the neck, but by the time i hit the top notes (partic the bottom two strings), i'm resting the palm (particularly the pad of my first finger, effectively the back of the knuckle) on the neck, and using that almost as a lever to play f sharp [ugh - how do you find the sharp / pound key on an apple keyboard!], g, and a).
is this a technique error creeping in (should the palm stand proud of the back of the neck throughout the scale, with just the thumb bracing), or is it okay?
i can go back and rebuild my fingering ( ::)) from a lower speed / using justin's minimum movement exercise, but want to check now before it becomes much more difficult to correct.
thanks!
also as ever, a huge thank you to justin & the forum for the site. what an awesome way to learn guitar!
psps. was there talk of an intermediate book coming out? i've bought both beginners book / beginners songbook, but both came out as i reached the end of that part of the course; would be great to get hold of an intermediate book as i actually work through it. of course, if anybody needs an intermediate student who's trying to follow justin's method to test-run the book..... ;-)
jus

joshs

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #36 on: August 30, 2012, 05:56:38 pm »
That certainly doesn't sound like good technique. If you're playing using the first shape (i.e. with the G on 3rd fret of 6th string), then your thumb/wrist/hand shouldn't be moving around very much. When you get to the higher strings, you can kind of rotate your wrist a little to open up some space (direction is as if loosening a screw). Your thumb pad should be a little towards the 6th string side of the neck and the nice fleshy part of it should be pressed with minimal pressure there and staying pretty still with maybe a slight pivot as you reach the higher and lower ends. Wrist should remain basically neutral, but I know mine has to bend slightly forward to reach the low strings. When playing scales like this at any given point all of the pressure on the guitar neck should be coming from a balance between the finger tip pressing the note and the thumb. The thumb is acting as a counterbalance to the fingertip and the guitar should be very still. (side note, the guitar should be hanging completely free so that if you took your hands and arms away it wouldn't move at all).

saichoo

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #37 on: September 11, 2012, 11:55:41 pm »
I just can't do this exercise. My timing never improves. I have always done this exercise at 60 bpm, one note per beat, for over A YEAR NOW, but I can never nail it perfectly; perfect, perfect, a little too fast, perfect, a  little too slow, too fast....
 To be honest, I can't even follow the metronome perfectly with clapping or tapping my foot. I have tried everything.

-Focus more
-Focus less
-Sway about while playing
-Closed eyes, eyes on fretboard, eyes on picking hand
-Using a metronome that visualise the rythm
-Using drum machines

Since timing is so fundemental to playing an instrument, I fear that I am not apt for music  and guitarplaying at all, and it is all terrifying.
What can I do about this? Or am I a lost cause ?

Subdividing the metronome beat can help with your timing. So instead of playing at 60bpm, play at 120bpm but only on beats 1 and 3 so that beats 2 and 4 become your "and" e.g. "One and Two and Three and Four and..." Playing at 240bpm and playing only beat one will help if you find that it isn't working at 120bpm.

Dance lessons will help. A good basic thing to pick up is stepping in time. Put the metronome around 100bpm and step with the right foot on beats 1 and 3 and left foot on beats 2 and 4.

dani_88

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #38 on: September 25, 2012, 06:22:21 pm »
hello,

has anyone here found it more difficult to play the 60bmp rather than the faster speeds like 130bpm?

thanks(:

Offline misterg

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #39 on: September 25, 2012, 06:34:58 pm »
hello,

has anyone here found it more difficult to play the 60bmp rather than the faster speeds like 130bpm?

thanks(:

Oh yes! It's good practice, though, especially if you try for "minimum movement", too.

Hello and welcome, by the way. :)

Andy

Offline mayuragr12

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #40 on: September 26, 2012, 12:25:31 pm »
Can i just put my metronome on 180 and play 4th notes.. instead of playing 8th notes on 90??
And so on..??

Offline Cue Zephyr

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #41 on: September 26, 2012, 01:08:51 pm »
No, because that's not really the point. :P

8th notes will improve your timing for when the metronome doesn't click.
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laughingboy

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #42 on: December 25, 2012, 03:52:30 am »
I've been using the metronome to practice both the major scale and the minor scale pattern which Justin introduced in the beginners course.  Back in lesson BC-185 Justin mentioned practicing 4 ways: 1) all down picks 2) all up picks 3) down and up each note 4) alternate.  I've been trying to do this for all my practice and using the "4 times through perfectly" test to bump up my speed.

I'm now at about 140 with quarter notes on the minor pentatonic.  My problem is that this is for alternate picking; I can't come close to keeping up with stage 3 which is essentially doing 8th notes at 140 (and probably not even at 120). So I'm now applying the "4x" test only to stage 4.

Is this correct?  Is it even necessary to practice stage 3 (or for that matter, 1 and 2) at this point?  Should I just be doing alternate picking only?

Thanks for your insights and the great site!


Offline Dr Winterbourne

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #43 on: December 25, 2012, 08:23:10 am »
My understanding is that the goal is alternate picking, and the others were just beginners stuff to get you there. Alternate picking is the thing you really want to work at and perfect.

The all down picks, now I think of it, is a metal rhythm technique, but I cannot think of any reason to continue doing it with scales.
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Offline filiped

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #44 on: January 29, 2013, 11:11:00 pm »
excuse me.

later on can I use up picks on the beat, in alternate picking.
is it ok?

if so I gotta reboot my brain.

Offline misterg

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #45 on: January 29, 2013, 11:50:21 pm »
later on can I use up picks on the beat, in alternate picking.
is it ok?

That sounds unusual to me - stick to picking down on the beat.

My 0.02p

Offline shadowscott007

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #46 on: January 30, 2013, 12:05:31 am »
Worry about later on, later.  Get 1/8th note alternate picking down.  Solid.  Then we'll talk about 16th note alternate picking.  It's all coming in your future if you are following the beginner's and intermediate's course.

Any once you get there your alternate picking  will be solid and automatic enough to "start with an up" if for some reasom you wanted to.

Shadow
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Offline filiped

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #47 on: January 30, 2013, 12:29:11 am »
dunno how I did it before.
now I find myself doing an up pick on the beat when I go up the scale.

Offline shadowscott007

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #48 on: January 30, 2013, 12:32:12 am »
1/8th notes, down on click, up in between.

Shadow
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Offline filiped

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Re: IM-124 • Technique: Playing Scales With A Metronome
« Reply #49 on: January 30, 2013, 12:37:44 am »
thanks

 

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