Author Topic: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)  (Read 25034 times)

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Offline justinguitar

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« Last Edit: May 13, 2011, 05:19:36 pm by justinguitar »
"You can get help from teachers, but you are going to have to learn a lot by yourself, sitting alone in a room." Dr. Seuss

Offline Mikey d

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #1 on: October 13, 2013, 07:41:40 pm »
Ye gods,
First time since starting the course have I clicked on a lesson help link to find it empty.
Am I to deduce from this that I am so bad, everyone else has nailed these chords.

So I'll reply to myself.....
Practice dear boy. 8)

Offline Aherd

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #2 on: November 17, 2013, 07:51:34 am »
Hello:DD I am enjoying and learning so much thanks to Justin and the whole team^^
My very first post~ Here goes.
I'm also finding somewhat a hard time practicing this lesson.
I'm 'working out' my index finger on the first fret.
Two questions:
1) Weird thing is, the positioning of my index finger varies with each chord:
     F, Fm, and this Fm7. 
     For the first two, my index finger is slightly higher(not to the point where the little joint is over the
     top), wonder if is this is normal?
2) Not much of a question, but rather looking for a reassurance.
    Is it possible that the shape of the index finger can prevent one from playing a complete barre?
    I find that the middle joint of my index finger is rather 'curved-in' that I keep missing the 2nd string, 
    though sometimes I can get a buzzing or even a clear sound, but rarely, no matter how hard I press:O

Thank you so much for everything!
   
     

Offline close2u

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #3 on: November 17, 2013, 08:16:59 am »
welcome to the forum
a standard work around barre chord problems is to play them further up the neck - say fret 5 or 7 - to develop the skill, strength, finger muscle memory, then move back down one fret at a time
this may help you too
 ;)
« Last Edit: November 18, 2013, 06:53:34 am by close2u »

Offline stitch101

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #4 on: November 17, 2013, 05:24:35 pm »

1) Weird thing is, the positioning of my index finger varies with each chord:
     F, Fm, and this Fm7. 
     For the first two, my index finger is slightly higher(not to the point where the little joint is over the
     top), wonder if is this is normal?
2)
    Is it possible that the shape of the index finger can prevent one from playing a complete barre?
    I find that the middle joint of my index finger is rather 'curved-in' that I keep missing the 2nd string, 
    though sometimes I can get a buzzing or even a clear sound, but rarely, no matter how hard I press:O

Thank you so much for everything!
   
     

Yes it is possible for the shape of your index finger to cause you problems but there is always a way.
For me to get all the strings to sound properly my index finger sits about 1/2 an inch above the fret
board. If it's any lower the G string gets muted in the groove of my knuckle.
Some people lean their index finger or bend it slightly. You'll have to find what works for you finger.
It's also better but not mandatory to keep your index finger the same for all your E shape barre chords.
The less you have to move or change your chords the quicker you can play.

Offline qwerties1

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #5 on: January 05, 2014, 08:17:55 am »
I just have a simple question, is it alright to have the upper segment (a third) of of my index finger over the neck when I'm playing F maj, min, maj7 and minor 7? I've been trying to lower my index finger when playing F barre chords , but I can't find any other ways to play them which I find comfortable.

Offline shadowscott007

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #6 on: January 05, 2014, 04:16:48 pm »
That seems to be a bit excessive overhang.

Shadow
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Offline Blaze

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #7 on: February 14, 2014, 11:13:00 pm »
I just have a simple question, is it alright to have the upper segment (a third) of of my index finger over the neck when I'm playing F maj, min, maj7 and minor 7? I've been trying to lower my index finger when playing F barre chords , but I can't find any other ways to play them which I find comfortable.

Yeah, I'd say that's fairly excessive. I always think my index finger is a bit high, but mine only extends above the fretboard by about half that much.  :P
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Offline pipsickle

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #8 on: November 26, 2014, 10:37:57 am »
I'm getting on quite well with these now, but am still having a bit of trouble with E7 shape at the higher frets (7 and 8) - I feel all squashed up and the barre goes weak (but not for Emin7). I can play both shapes nice and cleanly at all the lower frets.  I know the answer is probably just more practice, but wonder whether anyone else has had this problem or advice?

Offline Cataract

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #9 on: November 26, 2014, 10:41:35 am »
To be honest - I have had problems with every barre chord above the 7th fret :D I've noticed. that string A likes to buzz... But it is better and better everyday!

Offline pipsickle

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #10 on: November 26, 2014, 10:48:19 am »
Glad to hear I'm not alone! Yep, it's the A string - I can see that bit of the barre going weak/lifting when I play up high.

I didn't have this trouble when learning the E shape, in fact it was easier the higher I was, so I was finding this a bit strange :)

Offline TheCasual

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2014, 11:41:06 am »
Generally I think people avoid going past the 8th fret on chords and just go to a 5th thing root note.

Although alot 60's rock like The Kinks and The Stones seemed to like staying on one string.
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Offline Metal Girl

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #12 on: July 05, 2016, 01:10:41 am »
I have the same problem, I just keep trying to lower my index finger while playing 7 & min7 chords, even though the D string doesn't ring out, just to strengthen my hand, so I'll eventually be able to play it properly.

Offline Litzout

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #13 on: August 02, 2016, 02:22:36 am »
I have been stuck on Intermediate Foundation 2 for probably 3 months now because I cannot seem to nail down the 7 and Min7 grips.  I had the same trouble during the beginners course but was eventually able to work out a grip that consistently worked for F major on my acoustic.  But I am stuck now!  I have a large first knuckle that creates a substantial indent in the middle third of my barre finger.  This kind of creates a dead zone on my barre finger.  Moving the barre up or down just moves the problem area to a different string.  I am trying all the tips I can find like using the side of my finger, repositioning my thumb, changing angles of my wrist/elbow/arm.  I have had success making the 7 and minor 7 grips on my electric to where it is passable but not perfect.  However, I think I am using a lot more grip strength than proper technique to achieve those results.  I have had some luck here and there on the acoustic using very different barre positions for each of the E shape grips (i.e. top third of barre finger over neck for minor 7 and barely touching the tip of the finger on 6th string for major 7).  And yes, I have had the acoustic checked out by a professional.  I have reached the point where I am doing everything else well and am getting bored just getting held back by my barre grips.    My fear is creating a bad habit that will cost me later down the road.  Do I need to stick to this longer until I improve on the acoustic, or should I move on and hope those grips improve later with more practice? 

Offline Buckeye1971

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #14 on: August 02, 2016, 07:55:30 am »
hello Litzout,

  I am on beginner consolidation/ IM foundation 1. When I read your post I tried these chords for the first time and was able to do them on an acoustic, (granted, min 7 was a tad difficult at the first fret).  I have taken the course slowly . I have been learning guitar for 2 years now, (about an hour a day), which has given me time to build up hand strength, which is probably why I was able to do these chords relatively "easily". So I guess my question for you is how long have you been working on your hand strength playing barre chords? Justin says in the video that even he can struggle with them on acoustic if he has to hold it for a while, which I can understand because my hand ached playing that min7 at the first fret after only 10 seconds.

I guess my point is if you haven't been playing barre chords all that long perhaps your hand isn't strong enough or maybe you haven't developed enough of a callous on the side of your barre finger yet.

As far as your knuckle goes, post a photo to show us what you are dealing with. But in all honesty it probably isn't a problem you can't overcome. Have you ever seen Keith Richards knuckles? looks like somebody beat them with a ball peen hammer.  :)





Offline shadowscott007

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #15 on: August 02, 2016, 02:08:55 pm »
Litzout,

Try to put the "dent" between the strings.

Also try to roll your index finger so it is the edge not the flat that is pressing the strings.

Shadow
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Offline Litzout

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #16 on: August 02, 2016, 10:41:39 pm »
Thanks for the replies, Shadow and Buckeye (Greetings from Akron.  O-H....?)

I am definitely using the side of my finger and not the soft underside, and the dent doesn't seem to fit between two strings.  But I will work on it more with more focus on that particular solution.  My only success seems to be with using more of the underside and muscling the string down with the soft side of my finger. 

I started the beginner's course about 18 months ago.  I finished the beginner's consolidation and moved on to intermediate 1 about 5 months ago.  I moved through Intermediate 1 fairly quickly, and I decided to move on despite an issue with the G string not ringing out on the minor chord grip.   Justin said not to let that stop you, so I moved on to Intermediate 2 and have been there for 3-4 months. I have been working on barre grips for almost a year now, and I can do the E shaped major barre grip in all frets (including 1st fret) on my acoustic with no issues.  While I am sure I can always use more practice, I don't think that building strength is the true issue. 

E Shaped Major 7 is not as much of an issue, but both of the minor grips give me fits. I can move the "dent" up to where it is over the D string for the E shaped minor grip.  That works fine, but almost the whole top third of my finger is above the 6th string.  But then that means the "dent" will not let me push down on the D string for the minor 7 grip.  Sorry, having trouble trying to post a pic. 

I am good with all other aspects of Intermediate 2.  Do you think it would be worth it to move on to Intermediate 3 and continue to practice those barre grips?

Offline Buckeye1971

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #17 on: August 03, 2016, 02:08:11 am »
   I-O!  CLE eastside (Eastlake). Right up the road.


I had to use photobucket  to post photos. can't remember how to do it though.

If the barre chords are the only thing you have left  you probably should move on and just keep working on them. Thanks to you I actually have started working on them even though I just started IM 1. That way when I get to that stage I will be able to get it down pretty quickly. I can do them already but they do get my hands aching.  And by building up the hand strength  it will help my current playing as well.

As far as the dent goes, your finger placement may work it self out as you get more proficient. We all have our own problems. Right now minimum movement exercise is literally kicking my ass.



Offline shadowscott007

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #18 on: August 04, 2016, 02:25:45 am »
Also, try to focus on pressing the center section of your index finger down, not the tip and not the section nearest you palm.  If you focus on either end, the middle pops up.

Shadow
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Offline agflores

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #19 on: September 23, 2016, 11:14:37 pm »
I'm stuck on this lesson because I think i'm confusing the E shape chords from the CCG with this shape, but aren't both E shapes barre chords? What am I missing here?

Offline close2u

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #20 on: September 24, 2016, 09:59:19 am »
The chords are barre chords based on the open E shape.

What do you mean by CCG?

Offline m_c

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #21 on: September 24, 2016, 11:33:35 am »
I'm assuming CCG = Chord Construction Guide.

But as Close says, chords using the E open shape. Ignore whatever chord fingerings are mentioned in the CCG.

Offline stitch101

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #22 on: September 24, 2016, 05:55:22 pm »
agflores
Scroll down this page to the E shape barre chords. The root is what ever note is on the E string
under your index finger. 5th fret A 8th fret C and so on.
http://www.justinguitar.com/en/CH-000-Chords.php

Offline Rolandson

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #23 on: September 27, 2016, 02:10:51 pm »
I started this stage today.
The strings A,D and G are dead. Doesn't matter how hard I press it down.
I have no problem with the  barre on the 5ht and 6th string because the other 3 fingers are pressing those strings down.
Doesn't matter if I move my index finger up or down. There are always 3 strings dead.
My index finger is not  straight if that is the reason?
Maybe I need more callus. I don't know.
Need help.

This is exactly how my index fingers look like.

http://miketomich.com/sitebuilder/images/18_yrs_Chesterfield_Not_marked-407x342.jpg
« Last Edit: September 27, 2016, 03:37:08 pm by Rolandson »

Offline Heinz

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Re: IM-121 • E Shape Barre Chord Grip (7 and Min7)
« Reply #24 on: October 08, 2016, 03:40:10 pm »
Started with this lesson yesterday, and trying it on two different guitars yields a vastly different result.
On my electric, a Yamaha Pacifica 604w which is set up nicely, I can do it fairly easily. Sometimes a bit of buzz on 3rd or 4th string but nothing a bit of practice won't fix I hope.

Then again I have a mediocre (at best) Encore W2550FT acoustic with a high action that is generally a pain to play.. Really struggling on that one, I sometimes manage to play a minor 7 but it feels like regardless of the position I have to pull with my whole hand, flexing my biceps and everything, and even then it's mostly a miss. Just completely muted.

Here comes the question - should I keep trying or accept that the guitar is terrible for barres, and exercise those chords on the electric exclusively?
Hoping I'll be able to afford a better one some time in the next year but for the time I'm stuck with that.

 

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