Author Topic: Condenser Microphone  (Read 5326 times)

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Offline Ragz

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Re: Condenser Microphone
« Reply #30 on: January 21, 2011, 11:28:20 pm »
So you have that issue too with noise being picked up from other places in the house? That's the main reason i switched to my SM57. As i can keep all the other noise out, even at very close proximity to the mic.
My usb condensor used to pick up anything, from anywhere. What i'd like is a condensor mic that wasn't recording from every direction at once. Do they make ones like that?

Yeah, they make cardoid, supercardoid, and hypercardoid condenser mics. I'd still stick with a 57 to close-mic the cabinet - then maybe add a distant-mic'd condenser for ambience... but when you move the mic farther away it will pick up more environmental noise.
ok. so here's what my current one is then:
Cardioid pickup pattern
Large 19mm diaphragm

However, if this is thing is supposed to reject sound from behind it, it doesn't. In fact, it records just as well if from either the front of back of it. (perhaps my definition of front and back of the mic is different to what everyone else is thinking? To me, the front is one side of the mic (with the little LED light on that says it's on). And the back is the other side. Where as maybe others mean the front is the part of the mic that records and the back is the part the wire plugs into?)

Which one should i look for that would only pick up noise made in front of it? Basically i guess i want a directional LDC rather than an omni-directional. Is there a special term for this in the world of microphones?


Offline Scooter Trash

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Re: Condenser Microphone
« Reply #31 on: January 21, 2011, 11:39:50 pm »

However, if this is thing is supposed to reject sound from behind it, it doesn't. In fact, it records just as well if from either the front of back of it. (perhaps my definition of front and back of the mic is different to what everyone else is thinking? To me, the front is one side of the mic (with the little LED light on that says it's on). And the back is the other side. Where as maybe others mean the front is the part of the mic that records and the back is the part the wire plugs into?)

Which one should i look for that would only pick up noise made in front of it? Basically i guess i want a directional LDC rather than an omni-directional. Is there a special term for this in the world of microphones?

The front of the microphone is the end that you speak into. The back is the end that the cable plugs into (on most microphones)
The reason cardoid mics are called cardiod mics is that the pickup pattern resembles a heart. They reject (not eliminate) sound from the rear.
The closer you get the microphone to the source, the less ambient noise will be picked up. (it will pick up the same amount of noise but the signal to noise ratio will improve.)
If your mic is a cardoid mic, it is directional.
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Offline Cue Zephyr

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Re: Condenser Microphone
« Reply #32 on: January 21, 2011, 11:44:28 pm »
I think you want an LDD. Condensors aren't great at rejecting sound, especially the LDCs. My MK-319 has a horrible off-axis sound, but it's timbre is so sweet that I keep using this one on vocals. My M179 on the other hand is a bit more neutral off-axis. My SDC does a pretty decent job of rejecting sound directly behind it (I have proof, if you want to hear that.). The LDCs only reject well as figure-of-eight or a really, really tigh cardioid pattern. The figure-eight will have excellent rejection on either side of the diaphragm (90° off-axis). The tight cardioid will have the best rejection at 180° off-axis or directly behind it.

If you want other demos of my mics I can record a few so you get the idea. Or even a video.
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Offline TB-AV

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Re: Condenser Microphone
« Reply #33 on: January 21, 2011, 11:52:46 pm »
Rags the type of mic you are describing is s shotgun mic. Have you tried editing or gating your files after the tracking?

Maybe put the amp in a closet? Are people in the other room that loud into the signal?

Have you tried chaining them to a radiator in the basement?  ;)


EDIT: Ragz, here is a good visual on mic polar patterns and yes you were correct about the front and back. The part you sing into is the front and the other side is the back. If you are dealing with inexpensive mics you might want to verify that the capsule is not in backwards though. Some of these Chinese mics get that swapped around. Just because it says front or has a mark or led doesn't mean somebody didn't get it wrong.



« Last Edit: January 22, 2011, 12:32:21 am by TB-AV »
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Offline Ragz

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Re: Condenser Microphone
« Reply #34 on: January 22, 2011, 12:02:59 am »
Rags the type of mic you are describing is s shotgun mic. Have you tried editing or gating your files after the tracking?

Maybe put the amp in a closet? Are people in the other room that loud into the signal?

Have you tried chaining them to a radiator in the basement?  ;)




yeah, i tried gating and that does help. But my house is a loud one. And my condenser mic seems to be very sensitive. Noises even 50ft away are easily heard on the mic while recording. Perhaps i need to mess with how i use it. As going by scooter's definition of the front of the mic, that is usually facing the ceiling. So maybe pointing my mic differently will fix more of the external noise being heard. I'll give it a shot later and see how it works. Even though i don't use my usb mic anymore, it's useful to know and experiment with until i get round to buying an xlr condenser mic.
See the problem i've got is where i record, the kids also often play. So it can be rather trying to get a clean recording at times hehe.
The option of chaining them to the radiator would work if i had a radiator or a basement.
I have often looked at the roll of duct tape and wondered though, lol.
Putting the amp in a closet won't work as there's no closets close to where i record.

It's all good though, i'm a patient man. I'll figure something out. Once we get the new house, i will have a lot less external noise to worry about, as i'll have my recording room set far from where the kids will play. So it won't be as much of an issue then.


Offline Scooter Trash

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Re: Condenser Microphone
« Reply #35 on: January 22, 2011, 12:09:47 am »
Isolation cabinet: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGEccKzJ7uI

(or Guitar Rig 3)  :o
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Offline Ragz

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Re: Condenser Microphone
« Reply #36 on: January 22, 2011, 12:14:59 am »
Isolation cabinet
for my mic or my children? lol
the answer may be the latter methinks hehe


Offline TB-AV

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Re: Condenser Microphone
« Reply #37 on: January 22, 2011, 12:22:52 am »
Quote
for my mic or my children? lol

You need to ask?

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Offline TB-AV

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Re: Condenser Microphone
« Reply #38 on: January 22, 2011, 12:25:07 am »
Quote
As going by scooter's definition of the front of the mic, that is usually facing the ceiling.

That's for something like a 57. Not LDCs. Look at the link I posted above.
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Offline Scooter Trash

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Re: Condenser Microphone
« Reply #39 on: January 22, 2011, 12:29:06 am »
Isolation cabinet
for my mic or my children? lol
the answer may be the latter methinks hehe

LOL.. Don't put the kids in there..

BTW, I wouldn't use a condenser mic with an isolation cabinet - but I would use it with a 57.
If you can point your condenser mic towards the speaker (instead of towards the ceiling) and get it close enough to the cabinet without it clipping/distorting, it might improve the signal/noise (guitar/children) ratio.
Stocking up on duct tape, or chaining the kids to a radiator might be your best option from the sounds of it lol.
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Offline Scooter Trash

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Re: Condenser Microphone
« Reply #40 on: January 22, 2011, 12:30:28 am »

That's for something like a 57. Not LDCs. Look at the link I posted above.


Agreed.
(We were posting at the same time..)

Ragz.. What model LDC do you have?
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Offline Ragz

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Re: Condenser Microphone
« Reply #41 on: January 22, 2011, 07:06:49 am »
It's a Samson C01U usb condenser. It was good and still is.
However, i'm getting rid of it. As i don't use usb mic's anymore, now i've got my m-audio 410 interface, i am looking for a new xlr condenser mic.

I tried out the mic one last time tonight and never noticed before, but the hiss on it is insane. I don't remember it ever doing that before. But chances are it probably did and i didn't notice it. I turned the mic one way and then the other, and it didn't make a blind bit of difference. So much for it being a cardioid like that picture TB posted of the different types. I'd say it's more like an omni type. Didn't matter if i was recording with the sides of the mic, the front or the back. It recorded the same level each time. And also managed to record the fridge being opened in the kitchen downstairs. Which is approximately 60ft+ away.
The hiss may of been the air conditioning running that it was recording too come to think of it. As it just flicked on a second ago and sounds exactly like what the hiss was on the recording. lol.

I think ultimately i'm just going to get one or two of each type of mic available eventually. So i can play with them all and see what ones do what and how they all work.

Oh well. I'm off to buy some radiators and start digging a basement out,  ;D


Offline Scooter Trash

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Re: Condenser Microphone
« Reply #42 on: January 22, 2011, 08:37:25 am »
Kewl.
I looked at the polar pattern for that mic and it's hypercardoid.



I believe you had the orientation correct for that mic (pointing up with the LED facing the source.)

It would be nice to have two of every mic available. If you have a few thousand dollars of disposable income and can find one, a Nuemann U-67 would probably work well for what you're trying to do.
Realistically though, if I wanted a good large diaphragm condenser mic and had the cash I'd most likely get an AKG 414. I really like the smaller diaphragm AKG 451 condenser mics too. They're both a bit spendy though.
I don't have any experience with the less expensive condenser mics except the one that I just purchased and the only thing I would likely use it on is an acoustic guitar. It looks like there's some good suggestions earlier in this thread though.
I think that if I were recording a guitar cabinet in your environment I'd be happy with just the SM57.
Good luck with the radiators and the garage project.
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Offline Ragz

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Re: Condenser Microphone
« Reply #43 on: January 22, 2011, 03:05:58 pm »
I think that if I were recording a guitar cabinet in your environment I'd be happy with just the SM57.
Good luck with the radiators and the garage project.

Yeah, i am very happy with the SM57 to be honest. It does a really nice job and it's survived being thrown, bitten, swung around like a rope (and launched itself because the cable was loose and so off sailed the mic to my horror after i noticed one of the kids doing that with it). They know not to touch, but it's hard to resist when you're a child and the gear is right there staring at you. lol. So i forgive them. They do know better than to touch my guitars though (and they haven't messed with them at all)

I'll probably get another mic soon, but it will be another dynamic i expect. One that will do vocals a little easier than the SM57 does.


Offline bluepingu34

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Re: Condenser Microphone
« Reply #44 on: January 22, 2011, 07:16:45 pm »

 

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