Author Topic: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)  (Read 16424 times)

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Offline diademgrove

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Re: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)
« Reply #75 on: January 12, 2012, 07:30:08 pm »
This is my cover version. It is based on Dylan's version rather than Guns 'n' Roses. Feed back would be welcome, especially on my singing.


http://youtu.be/_l-UpE25rFI

Thanks for listening

Offline Tourniquet

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Re: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)
« Reply #76 on: January 12, 2012, 09:40:18 pm »
Far too heavy use of audio effects all round. Less is more.
Timing seems off at times, the drum track really highlights it.
Singing is hard to judge, the effects obscure much, the pitch seems acceptable but unlike any version I'm familiar with (end of line pitch in particular sounds flat, but done repeatedly it sounds more like a stylistic choice)

interesting take on it ;)
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Offline diademgrove

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Re: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)
« Reply #77 on: January 12, 2012, 10:03:39 pm »
Far too heavy use of audio effects all round. Less is more.
Timing seems off at times, the drum track really highlights it.
Singing is hard to judge, the effects obscure much, the pitch seems acceptable but unlike any version I'm familiar with (end of line pitch in particular sounds flat, but done repeatedly it sounds more like a stylistic choice)

interesting take on it ;)

Thanks Tourniquet. The effects will disappear when I'm happy with my signing. As you say they hide a multitude of sins. I don't know what happened with the timing, it turns the beat around when you don't expect it. It seemed to go with the mood of the song so I didn't try to sing it again. Compared with my other efforts at signing I'm glad I'm mostly in key and that the flat notes are consistent.

Have you any further advice on improving my pitch so I can sing something that's recognisable?

Thanks for listening.

Diadem

Offline Tourniquet

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Re: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)
« Reply #78 on: January 13, 2012, 10:15:17 am »
Hiding sins is fine for performance, but not for active critique or self improvement.

Pitch:
Just keep recording yourself singing (if you can setup a live microphone so you hear yourself realtime it's quicker)
Try different keys, if the song takes you too close to the edge of your range it can skew notes.
Don't fight it, it's common to try and correct pitch problems by force which tends to just make it harder. much improvement can be had just by learning how to relax.

General:
Find a song you know well, preferably something with various drawn out notes and sing it without backing. (Lying eyes by the eagles is the song that always works for me)
Listen carefully for any notes or vowels that seem to stand out more than the rest or maybe start to make your skull buzz.
focus on these notes and those around them, use them repeatedly and make minor alterations to the shape of your mouth, the tension in your throat, tilt of your head, straightness of your back..... any and every variable. keep those that positively contribute, discard those that don't (temporarily, a change that does nothing early on may make a huge different once it has more support)
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Offline diademgrove

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Re: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)
« Reply #79 on: January 14, 2012, 07:56:33 am »
Hiding sins is fine for performance, but not for active critique or self improvement.

Pitch:
Just keep recording yourself singing (if you can setup a live microphone so you hear yourself realtime it's quicker)
Try different keys, if the song takes you too close to the edge of your range it can skew notes.
Don't fight it, it's common to try and correct pitch problems by force which tends to just make it harder. much improvement can be had just by learning how to relax.

General:
Find a song you know well, preferably something with various drawn out notes and sing it without backing. (Lying eyes by the eagles is the song that always works for me)
Listen carefully for any notes or vowels that seem to stand out more than the rest or maybe start to make your skull buzz.
focus on these notes and those around them, use them repeatedly and make minor alterations to the shape of your mouth, the tension in your throat, tilt of your head, straightness of your back..... any and every variable. keep those that positively contribute, discard those that don't (temporarily, a change that does nothing early on may make a huge different once it has more support)

Sounds like a lot of hard work. But nothing in life worthwhile is usually easy. When it works I'll post something with no effects (well maybe a couple). Could you please explain whether my skull should buzz and if so how do I get there?

Thanks again.

Offline Tourniquet

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Re: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)
« Reply #80 on: January 14, 2012, 07:36:00 pm »
Could you please explain whether my skull should buzz and if so how do I get there?

Therein lies the difficulty with learning and teaching singing. Even face to face, explaining how to control a particular set of throat muscles just doesn't translate well. have a look at the primer in my signature, there are links to a few instructional sites that might interest you.
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Offline diademgrove

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Re: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)
« Reply #81 on: January 14, 2012, 09:04:51 pm »
Could you please explain whether my skull should buzz and if so how do I get there?

Therein lies the difficulty with learning and teaching singing. Even face to face, explaining how to control a particular set of throat muscles just doesn't translate well. have a look at the primer in my signature, there are links to a few instructional sites that might interest you.

Thanks again, I'll have a look at the sites. I tried singing something straight, no music, just a metronome beat, turned out wierd. It was vaguely recognisable, but.... I'll have another go tomorrow. Thanks again for the advice. If I get a buzz in my skull I'll let you know.

Offline close2u

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Re: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)
« Reply #82 on: February 10, 2012, 06:45:32 am »
bump

come on folks  - climb aboard!

Offline Gi11es

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Re: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)
« Reply #83 on: February 24, 2013, 05:25:35 pm »
Hello,

This is my recording of me strumming over a backing track and trying to play with the chords as explained in Justin's video.

http://youtu.be/Dr0a2CMoE3w

Gilles

Offline close2u

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Re: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)
« Reply #84 on: October 11, 2014, 06:30:44 pm »
Good effort Gi11es, sounds like you've got the chord changes coming along nice & clean ... well done for leaping in ...  8)
This is a late reply - you'll be even better by now I would think - can you sing & plat together on this yet?

Offline Coda

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Re: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)
« Reply #85 on: December 27, 2014, 01:53:45 pm »
And one more version, folks; following close2u's suggestion I'm re-posting "Knockin'..." recorded via LINE 6 GX hardware, POD Farm 2.5 and Audacity software.

The guitar is a Gibson SG, three tracks were merged for the final result.

https://soundcloud.com/coda1953/knocking-ohd

   

Offline Bissrok

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Re: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)
« Reply #86 on: November 26, 2017, 10:11:19 pm »
I'm practicing my E shape major scale. Some of it came out a bit wonky...

https://soundcloud.com/bissrok/knockin-on-heavens-door

Offline phx1973

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Re: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)
« Reply #87 on: June 20, 2018, 08:53:36 pm »
I think I win the award for a long-time member waiting the longest to contribute to "guitar challenge #1". Haha.


Went a little excessive on the reverb in post production. What do you think? Too much? I actually think it sounds cool but want feedback!


https://soundcloud.com/phx1973/bob-dylan-knockin-on-heavens-door-acoustic-and-guitar-cover
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Offline DavidP

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Re: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)
« Reply #88 on: June 21, 2018, 06:39:31 am »
I think I win the award for a long-time member waiting the longest to contribute to "guitar challenge #1". Haha.

Went a little excessive on the reverb in post production. What do you think? Too much? I actually think it sounds cool but want feedback!
Well done, Tosh.

Rhythm is good ... couple of stutters once or twice I think and to keep growing this one, I'd suggest thinking about volume accents and perhaps someway to differentiate a little more between verse and chorus.

Mix wise, just listening I'd like the vocal a little more prominent ... feels like the guitar is right up front and drowning it out.  Now if your reference to reverb is on the vocals then I think that would be contributing, since I think reverb tends to push the vocals back in the mix, you can lose a little punch.

That said, I didn't hear a song that was "drenched" in reverb, so would agree sounding pretty cool overall, aside from the above.

What I'd suggest to try to improve would depend on what tracks you have to work with. 

So assuming a separate vocal and guitar track then you could duplicate the vocal, keep one dry and add reverb to the other and then balance the levels to retain the upfront punch with some reverb to give it a more natural, fuller sound.

You could also duplicate the guitar track, adjust the start of one by 20-40ms and pan the tracks left and right.  Being slightly out of sync would let the ear still hear one guitar sound but to hear a fuller sound with greater width.  The difference between the two should not be so much that they are heard as two separate tracks (unless you want to create a more echoing effect), just enough to get that sense of width that creates a little more space in the centre for the vocal.

All that said, you doing really well in developing your ability to play and sing...keep up the good work.

I'm inspired ... perhaps time I went back into the "studio" and produced one to share here.  I did post a version back in August last year in AVOYP so might be interesting to hear how it would sound now.

Offline phx1973

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Re: Guitar Challenge I - Knocking On Heaven's Door (Bob Dylan / GnR etc)
« Reply #89 on: June 21, 2018, 11:20:51 pm »
Well done, Tosh.

Rhythm is good ... couple of stutters once or twice I think and to keep growing this one, I'd suggest thinking about volume accents and perhaps someway to differentiate a little more between verse and chorus.

Mix wise, just listening I'd like the vocal a little more prominent ... feels like the guitar is right up front and drowning it out.  Now if your reference to reverb is on the vocals then I think that would be contributing, since I think reverb tends to push the vocals back in the mix, you can lose a little punch.

That said, I didn't hear a song that was "drenched" in reverb, so would agree sounding pretty cool overall, aside from the above.

What I'd suggest to try to improve would depend on what tracks you have to work with. 

So assuming a separate vocal and guitar track then you could duplicate the vocal, keep one dry and add reverb to the other and then balance the levels to retain the upfront punch with some reverb to give it a more natural, fuller sound.

You could also duplicate the guitar track, adjust the start of one by 20-40ms and pan the tracks left and right.  Being slightly out of sync would let the ear still hear one guitar sound but to hear a fuller sound with greater width.  The difference between the two should not be so much that they are heard as two separate tracks (unless you want to create a more echoing effect), just enough to get that sense of width that creates a little more space in the centre for the vocal.

All that said, you doing really well in developing your ability to play and sing...keep up the good work.

I'm inspired ... perhaps time I went back into the "studio" and produced one to share here.  I did post a version back in August last year in AVOYP so might be interesting to hear how it would sound now.

Thanks, David. I have to say your knowledge and understanding of mixes is really impressive.  I learn something every time you post about it. This was just a one-track recording though, so not much I can do there. I see what you’re saying about the vocals. Maybe I need to sing louder or play softer, not sure.


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BC completed August, 2016
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